SGA: Vegas and a rant

[tenaya]

If only someone other than Cooper was in charge of this. :(

First off, Cooper fancies himself a great artiste and he isn't. It's amazing how much crap he shoots, how much money he wastes and because he's one of the bosses, he gets away with it. So, because he wrote and directed this episode, for the first time in either SG1 or SGA, the show shoots out of the B.C. And he secured the rights to two songs and that had to cost a bunch--I guess because he got complimented on using CCR on Unending, he'd use two songs here.

His directing style reminds me of a newbie vidder that gets a new program. The CSI homages of the establishing shots of Vegas and the odd edits should have been used sparingly instead of continuously; they got boring fast. As did the extensive exposition. And if I hadn't heard about the Sopranos, I'd have never figured out why the action stopped so we could listen to lame conversation between two gamblers.

The writing was at its most painful when McKay had a long list of why Sheppard is a loser; we didn't need all those details for the audience to get that. Plus, it didn't make sense that they would have profiled Sheppard that thoroughly. They know his fav gum? Seriously? He was just the detective on the case, not the perp.

What I liked was how Sheppard looked, that he had the Johnny Cash poster still. I actually giggled at Picardo's delivery of that line about the Trek Experience closing.

Parts that pissed me off was anytime Cooper used the medium to take his potshots. Sheppard disses Science Fiction? Really? I saw that as your typical Hollywood type that disdains the very thing that earns him his money because he's too cool to like the crap he dishes out to the suckers that watch his show. It's a contemptible attitude but it's something they just have to do if they get the chance to show their peers that they really do have better taste than to like their own product. Cooper killing Sheppard--he has quite the petty little habit of killing actors who thwart him in real life; how many times did he kill off Daniel again? Just get a damn voodoo doll and pins and lock yourself in the bathroom, for crying out loud.

And of course, I hated Keller. Staite needs to write herself a post-it note to NEVER EVER accept a role of a doctor EVER AGAIN! I just want to ask her to please stop that, don't do that, you're only embarrassing yourself.

As for the crossover idea (and how fannish is that?) it was okay. If it hadn't been a self-indulgent fest, it could have been kinda neat. It's not anything I'll watch again.

And because this is a SGA post, I'll just add that I read Wright's Q&A on Mallozzi's blog. Nothing is ever their fault, is it? His contempt permeated his answers; hello, it IS possible to answer a question politely or if you don't want to give away that info, simply say that. I swear The Spin is something these people live and breathe until they couldn't give an honest answer if their life depended upon it.

I think the most tragic part of all this is that the concept of a Stargate is appealing no matter who is turning out the product. They had the luck to cast some good actors who really added to what was written and made us like and care for the characters. And then the lazy, egotistical writers don't put any real effort into the shows to fulfill their potential. They aren't telling stories they need to tell, but writing whatever they can think of at the last minute to fill in the time between commercial breaks. How on earth do they think this technique will produce a more mainstream show in SG:U? Something tells me they will aim for the more basic common denominator--maybe they will have a brainstorm and finally put in a few fart jokes cause we know how their target audience of young men feel about those.

Comments

[lukitas.livejournal.com]

I liked some parts of it. The idea was great, and had its potential, but in some parts in the middle get reallly bored. That's not csi is stargate atlantis, and it didn't have an stargate ( barely named ) or atlantis on it. So not my fav episode, but I get to enjoy little parts of it

and I'm trying not to think too much about the spin off, as initially I didn't like atlantis, and in the end I adore it ( some episodes of course )

[green-grrl.livejournal.com]

I liked it a little better than you did. I like the CSI "style" and was pleased they went with it all the way through--it's an alternate universe, so it looks like one. That said, I don't think they're as skilled at using that style for storytelling as CSI is, so where in CSI, every flash, every cut, every color helps tell the story, some of these were just gratuitous for "look" and were distracting instead of supporting. There's a way to do it properly, and they didn't take the time to learn it before jumping in.

I know they filmed a lot of the ep in Vancouver, because a friend of mine was in it as an extra there!

They spent the money on three songs--the Marilyn Manson one, the Johnny Cash one, and the Rolling Stones' Sympathy for the Devil. It had to have cost a fortune. But it goes with the look and feel--I actually really liked it. Again, it fits that CSI universe.

It didn't surprise me that Rodney had all the scoop on John. There were eight bodies over three months, and the SGC would have been going all out to find the Wraith before the cops did, including knowing who the lead detective on the case was. His military record would have been a cinch to get, and the rest not too difficult. One stop at a convenience store by John in the last week would yield his gum preference, but it sounds invasive, like "we know everything about you."

I see John's anti-scifi line as him being Jack: Mark 2 again, but you're right--TPTB do have contempt for the genre.

Am I the only one who doesn't read John as dead in that last scene? If he was well enough to stagger away from the car before collapsing, he couldn't actually bleed out in the ensuing ten seconds. Possibly saved by an ambulance, almost definitely by a beam-up.

My single thought on Keller was thank God we were spared the shmoopy ship for one ep.

What I especially missed was Teyla and Ronon. They have come to Earth before--why didn't they accompany Rodney on this mission? It might be a subtle message from TPTB (?!) that without John, Atlantis wouldn't have Teyla or Ronon either. But without John meeting Teyla, would they have woken up the Wraith? Bah.

Joe's blog just raises my blood pressure. Every. Time. They are entitled, self-centered jerks who cannot see past their own blinders. Completely without understanding that there is a worldview outside their own. Ugh.

[aurora-novarum.livejournal.com]

His directing style reminds me of a newbie vidder that gets a new program. The CSI homages of the establishing shots of Vegas and the odd edits should have been used sparingly instead of continuously; they got boring fast.

I find RCC is very much stuck on being a newbie director and too enamored of his cool camera angles. He doesn't do it enough to settle down. (Although, I thought "Doppleganger" turned out okay.)

I loved those CSI establishing shots because it was several seconds of air time I didn't have to transcribe any dialogue or action in doing the wiki's ep transcript. But...that's a personal perk. LOL

Actually, I liked Vegas (despite lack of Ronon and Teyla and the bizarro doggie/finger story). I thought it was a clever story and a different twist and tone. Of course, SGA has never captured my heart like SG-1, so I don't have high expectations for it. But I notice there doesn't seem to be a middle ground for this episode. People either love it, or hate it.

[astrumporta.livejournal.com]

I'm with you on BW's q&a. I just don't get what his strategy is, to engage fans in such a rude way, unless it's just more self-indulgence. I mean, he even made fun of the fawning comments and questions! I almost feel he's telling on-line fans that we haven't done him any good. We didn't get them 2.0 ratings, therefore our likes and dislikes are irrelevant, and we deserve a good scolding. Also, he doesn't think insulting us will hurt SGU. He's going for "mainstream" audiences who will never read JM's blog. Still, could he not fake being a nice guy just for PR's sake? I really don't get it.

I did like Vegas, but I'm a visually-oriented person so all the quick-cuts stimulated my brain. I think verballly-oriented people found it really boring. I also thought some of it was a parody of CSI, not an homage. If it wasn't, then yeah, RCC really needs some film school.

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

I just wish a writer other than Cooper or Mallozzi had written this and anyone else to direct it.

I don't know if I'll watch Universe yet. I suppose it depends on the casting. And I know Bridge will screw it up anyway. They are quite predictable that way. Best not to get too attached....

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

As a whole, the ep was okay but Cooper's mistakes are a red flag for me. The man is so pompous and delusional about his abilities. He can definitely write better than Mallozzi but this whole artiste thing he is deluding himself with is laughable--except he's got the power and money to keep doing it. We have only a few shots of SG1 and SGA left when they do the movies. If he gets involved, he'll screw it up.

So, you probably know more better than the rest of us how many of those establishing shots of Vegas they were (and enjoying every one of them.) *g*

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

Other show runners at least make the attempt to appreciate their fans--the people that take the time to give imput for their shows. I know we can't keep a show on by ourselves, but we are the canary in the coal mind; Wright's rude dismissal of us misses the point. If you can't keep your fans happy, odds are the mainstream audience won't bother either.

He either can't take any sort of criticism and he felt good to hit back in kind (pretty childish) or he's the type that likes to bully and and be mean and gets a kick out of doing it to people who are trying to communicate with him--an abuser who appreciates people who set themselves up to be abused. The beauty of it is he doesn't have any real world contact with us. He can be rude and there will be no repercussions.

This just gives another insight into what type of man he is and I think it shows he is petty enough to have gotten rid of Paul to prove a point about who is the boss.

I like the film tricks on CSI but there were too many and too clumsily done on Vegas. Cooper homaged Star Wars to death. I have to say I don't think he was parodying CSI as there should have been more humor in it. That's my guess though.

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

I like CSI and I like the spiffy signatures. I thought it fun in Vegas the first few times but then I thought, "oh no, don't do that again!" Cooper doesn't understand the pacing of that show. In CSI those things are moody and increase the tension; not so here.

I was wondering how much was filmed in Vegas as some of the countryside is very un-Nevada like.

Three songs! Whereas rock and roll is great in CSI, that's really self indulgent here. Maybe Cooper needs to work this phase out doing music vids. *g*

You're right about how invasive it sounded when McKay was laying Sheppard's life before him. I thought that level of detail was especially for to prove how invasive they had been, and I really don't see why they had to do plot wise. Sheppard is a cop who is trying to catch the Wraith. McKay wants the Wraith, too. Why profile the cop? Okay, the cop is Sheppard and they will know is military background but they way they did it, it seemed like they wanted to take the starch out of him, make him see what a loser he is and then send him running with humiliation. Why?

A shot to his chest would have slowed him down sooner than it did, but hey it's tv. So, yes, he could be still alive and therefore he could be saved. But I think Cooper liked killing him. His death was heroic, but Cooper *likes* killing them. My personal opinion is that deathfics are an easy path to get emotions from your readers; the same goes here. BUT...another writer could easily bring in that helicopter and IV and save John's life. *g*

As for Keller, we still had McKay and Keller passing hots looks at each other as they passed in the hallway. I am so sick of it.

Yeah, Teyla and Ronon were pretty much dumped in favor of Keller, or if they were there, it was all about Keller then, too. I just hate that.

I completely agree about Joe's blog. You said it.

[green-grrl.livejournal.com]

John refused to sign the non-disclosure agreement, so I suspect they wanted to intimidate the hell out of him to keep him from revealing their secrets. And, because he's a known maverick, to keep him in line. Though Woolsey (a la the SG-1 era) would be the one far more likely to work that angle than Rodney.

Cooper can think he killed John, but not in my reality. ;-)

Eh, I thought Rodney was nothing but coolly professional towards Keller, and her little smile was ambiguous--could be co-worker or crush. I'll take co-worker for this 'verse, please!

This entire season I've actively liked The Shrine, Daniel being there for the two-parter, and this ep. The rest of it has been trite, hackneyed, and/or way-too-much-Keller. I am so not sorry it's been cancelled. I trust these characters with the fanficcers far more.

[nausica2.livejournal.com]

I liked parts of Vegas, I agree on the bad pacing, and that's because RCC can't direct at all.

As for the writing, I liked parts of it. I would have liked to see more of how Atlantis, the team and Rodney were, but to me AU Rodney was a very unhappy person, and he clinged on Sheppard because he wanted what he had sen in the other AU. The look between Rodney and Keller didn't bother me much, it felt quite fake (actually I think the ship in our reality is bad done but doesn't bother to me as much as other people).

It's a shame, because before he turned into an idiotic prick, RCC could write. He actually wrote some of my favourite SG.-1 episdes. Then he was replaced by a pod person.

Speaking of that, BW's Q&A was so funny. He was condescending, but some of the questions were very stupid (again, who the hell would ask him questions knowing how all of the Q&A in that blog end!)

And hey, there was one shining light in those answers. The one he gave to the person who asked about Jonas Quinn. I'm still laughing at that.

One redeeming thing: BW can still write. The Srine was a fine episode. Problem is, what made SG-1 good was the team Glassner-Wright, and it's pretty obvious they didn't part well. Shame.

[margec01.livejournal.com]

I liked it a little bit better than you did--but not much. How may SGA AU's have I read which are SO much better than this? Almost all of them--especially if they contained a bit of actual characterization instead of being all....arty. (Or at least Cooper thinks he was being arty.)

I moaned when I saw Cooper both wrote and directed. The man CAN write a good story, but like most writers he shouldn't direct his own work. He needs someone to pull him back instead of falling in love with his own stuff.

If we were getting another season of SGA, this wouldn't have bothered me so badly. But for my second to last SGA episode EVER, I would have liked to see SGA. But Cooper and the gang wanted to get a free trip to Vegas. I quit watching CSI:Vegas several years ago because I got tired of the bullets gouging into the body in slow-mo, and all the "arty" crap. As you said, a small "homage" would have been enough. How dumb and blind do they think we are? Forget I asked that--they are sure we're ignorant and untaught...as well as old.

Wright's Q&A? Just more of the same old shit. I'm glad I'm not going to Vancouver again this year. I don't need to pay money to hear more of the same.

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I'm sure if Wright and Cooper go to the con, they will be pushing Universe and will be short to anyone that can't get past SGA. They just don't get it and are so self absorbed they never will. I don't need to pay to hear them tell me I'm not relevent.

Wright and Cooper can both write. Cooper should never be allowed to direct, especially if it's his script.

Using the second to last ep of SGA so they can go to Vegas. I think that's what has tainted my view of that ep. It's an AU, it was okay, the concept intriguing, but it's not what I wanted for the penultimate ep.

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

You're right that this McKay was unhappy. I am very intrigued as to how this universe interacted with ours. A very interesting story we won't get to see.

The McKay/Keller ship is terribly done. I thought the look between them was to tell us they were sleeping together in this universe. First name basis, both turn backwards to maintain visual contact for as long as possible. I'm just tired of the damn ship because Bridge does it so badly. I like ship in Bones. I find the interaction between Ziva and Tony playful and fun. I'm not against ship, just badly done ship.

As for the blog, Wright or Mallozzi should have kicked out some of the repetitive questions rather than answer with snarky responses. And some of the questions were a bit embarrassing. Yeah, the Jonas one was funny but I felt guilty laughing over the answer. Rudeness is embarrassing, even if I felt that way myself, at least I didn't give that response to a Jonas lover.

Apparently Wright and Glassner had screaming fits at each other. No love lost there. Glassner came to a con at Los Angeles once. Wasn't invited, just came to check out the scene. He answered some questions. Seemed like a real nice guy. I remember Michael was there and really seemed happy to see him. And when asked who was his fav character, he said Daniel, and that he liked the exploration of aspect of the show the best. It's really too bad that he lost the kids in the custody battle.

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

John refused to sign the non-disclosure agreement, so I suspect they wanted to intimidate the hell out of him to keep him from revealing their secrets. And, because he's a known maverick, to keep him in line. Though Woolsey (a la the SG-1 era) would be the one far more likely to work that angle than Rodney.

Okay, that makes sense. Thanks.

I'm sure John is being rescued at this moment in many stories. *g* We didn't get the close up of him dying after all.

I unfortunately read their first name basis, long lingering look to mean they were an item there, too. Bridge does ship badly and I think that's why I'm supersensitive to it. Unfortunate for me. :(

I have to agree with you about what eps stand out this year...even this one is unique and gave me a strong reaction. I'm sitting here trying to think of other eps and all I can think of is them in relation to Keller, or that stupid fog ep of Mallozzi. SGA has lots of stories left but I don't want to see any more by Bridge.

[green-grrl.livejournal.com]

SGA has lots of stories left but I don't want to see any more by Bridge.

That's why we have fanfic!!! *clings to LJ*

(BW made me so nervous by saying the next movie is Jack-centric. Because YAY Jack! But JM has said repeatedly he believes Jack and Sam have been together since Threads, and the shippers constantly inundate them with pleas to "finally" give them the confirmation they've been waiting for for so long .... I think that's one time I'm glad TPTB have no problem with dicking over the fans. But I don't trust them to not go there, either. Blergh.)

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

:::sigh:::

I know, I know. :(

Jack = Yay!

But BW has already titillated the panel at ComicCon that he was writing a S/J scene--but with a twist. I took that to probably mean it'll be a fake out like they usually do. And BW is writing the script, right?

JM is shit stirrer. He's been blowing the shippers with that type of comments even before Threads. I'd not heard him say that. What's he seeing in Threads that I'm not seeing? Carter nearly gets married, goes to Jack's house to give him a last chance to fall for her emotional ultimatum to step up to the plate and declare his love--and finds him with a hot chick. How the hell does that put them together? Besides, his fondling of the flagpole while looking at Flag!Daniel speaks volumes. He must have picked that one because that was the last ep where Jack is a regular (Moebius was mostly not in our timeline and besides they killed our team in that show if you want to get look at the facts. Lazy bastard writers.)

Thank god JM is not the top dog at Bridge because he might make ship canon.

I do fear what they will come up with and even if they still don't make S/J canon, I know having to sit through their oh so clever scene will annoy me again. It's an old stale joke that they like to torment the shippers with. Tormenting shippers = good, but it's akin to having a dweeby acquaintance that tells the same painful joke whenever he gets the chance. It just makes Carter look like a fool now. How many decades will she moon after that man?

:::deep breath:::

Oh dear. You seem to have hit my button. *g* Maybe I'm the dweeby acquaintance that keeps going off on the same subject. Oh well.

[lukitas.livejournal.com]

I'll watch it, at least first episodes to see what they do, and then decided. As I really didn't like atlantis at the beginning and later really liking a lot, I'll wait till decide, and just keep watching it until episoides keep being bad bad and worse

[tenaya.livejournal.com]

Same here. I'd had it by the first half of the first season but The Storm really worked for me and I was looking forward to the next half. Letters from Pegasus was good too.

We'll just wait and see, but I'm feeling pretty detached about it.

[green-grrl.livejournal.com]

I think he means that since Jack and Kerry broke up and Jack left the SGC that he prefers to think they finally took the plunge behind the scenes. Ugh.

JM wrote that cut scene in Trio that ended up on the DVD about Carter having someone back in Washington close to retirement. (First time deleted scenes have ended up on the DVD--coincidence? I think not.) Since then he's been willing to talk about his personal shippiness in his blog, though because of Ripple Effect, e.g., I suspect another PTB may be equally against it. (I hope!)

But yes, he loves to stir up the pot because he's an asshole and a bully, just like BW. I agree with you completely. A not-actually S/J scene is almost as bad as a real one. It diminishes Sam, and as much as I loathe the shippers' claims to entitlement, I would prefer it if everybody could be able to read in their ship of choice in a purely gen show. It's a button for me, too!